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Alt 10.09.2011, 23:02   #11
salem68
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Habe die Kabel gebrückt nur der Klimkompressor läuft noch immer nicht . Woran kann es denn jetzt noch liegen??
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Alt 11.09.2011, 01:54   #12
Erich
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Registriert seit: 19.07.2002
Ort: Joso
Fahrzeug: E32 750iL 11/88
Standard

eventuell zu wenig R134a drauf?
Vielleicht hilft das
Externer Link (&Ooml;ffnet in neuem Fenster, der Forumsbetreiber distanziert sich vom Inhalt extern verlinkter Seiten.) http://www.compressortech.co.uk/down...l_chart_04.pdf
oder besser noch dieser Link zu Hella, die geben sogar die Daten an fuer R12 und R134a
Externer Link (&Ooml;ffnet in neuem Fenster, der Forumsbetreiber distanziert sich vom Inhalt extern verlinkter Seiten.) http://hella-online.code-x.de/upload...gQty_EN_UK.pdf
Refrigerant filling quantity (g)
E31
R12 1900-1950
R134a 1525-1575

E32
R12 1900-1950
R134a 1525-1575
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Alt 12.09.2011, 22:31   #13
Fortress01
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Registriert seit: 20.06.2009
Ort: Windorf - LKR. Passau
Fahrzeug: E32-750i (06/92)
Standard Klimakompressor

Hallo Salem68,

leider komme ich erst heute dazu dir auf deine Frage zu antworten.

Folgendermaßen bin ich vorgegangen:

Nach Ausbau des BMW/Bosch original Kompressors hab ich den neuen einpoligen Kompressor zunächst vorbereitet. Das Kompressor-Öl gewechselt und die vorgegebene Menge eingefüllt. Den Kompressor habe ich an die originale Aufnahme montiert und mußte jedoch einen längeren Keilrippenriemen einbauen. Danach habe ich die Anlage evakuieren und füllen lassen. Versuchsweise habe ich an dem einen Pol des Kompressors ein Kabel angeschlossen und dieses mit einem Pluspol des Fahrzeuges ( Zigarettenanzünderdose ) verbunden. Die Magnetkupplung zog sofort an und d.h. der Komprssor war einsatzbereit. Am Anschluß der Locksensors habe ich die ehemals vorhandenen Kabel, die zum originalen KJompressor führten getrennt und miteinander verbunden. Ich mußte aber feststellen, daß beim Einschalten des Klimaschalters die Klimaanlage nicht funktionierte. Den Locksensor habe ich daraufhin geöffnet und eine Schmorstelle auf der Platine entdeckt. Diese war offensichtlich schon längere Zeit vorhanden. Ich habe zufällig bei ebay den Locksensor mit identischer BMW - Teielnummer erwerben können und diesen an meiner geänderten Schaltung angeschlossen.

Die Anlage arbeitet seitdem zu meiner vollsten Zufriedenheit

Die entsandenen Kosten:

Hella-Klimakompressor, neu € 360,90 zuzügl. Versandkosten
Keilrippenriemen, neu € 9,00
2 Riemenspanner, neu € 65,00 ( bei den alten Spannern war die Spannkraft unzureichend!)
Locksensor, gebraucht € 15,00 ( ebay )

Die Reparatur hat mich demzufolge rd. € 450,00 gekostet, zuzügl. Evakuieren und Füllen der Anlage, je nach Werkstattpreis.

Die eigene Arbeitszeit rechnet man ja nicht. Der eigene Zeitaufwand beträgt ca. 2,5 Stunden.
Ich hoffe dir mit meinen Inforamtionen weitergeholfen zu haben.

LG

Peter
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Alt 18.09.2011, 10:10   #14
salem68
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Hallo Peter, danke für die Antwort! Bin bei mir alles soweit nochmal durchgegangen . Wenn ich die Masse direkt auf den Klimakompressor lege, läuft er auch sofort an. Habe jetzt nochmal ein Frage. Kannst du mir sagen Welche Nummer der Lock- Sensor hat, wo er im E31 sitzt und für welches Kühlmittel er ursprünglich gedacht war. Den beim E31 wurde wohl ab Bj.. 1993 schon das R134a verwendet. Glaube ich zumindest. Muss die Anlage doch irgendwie zum laufen bekommen.
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Alt 20.09.2011, 13:24   #15
salem68
Gast
 
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Fahrzeug:
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Kannst du helfen ??
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Alt 21.07.2013, 09:17   #16
Erich
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Registriert seit: 19.07.2002
Ort: Joso
Fahrzeug: E32 750iL 11/88
Standard

die Lage des Lock Sensors Relais sollte doch im Stromlaufplan gezeigt sein mit Bild unter component location views, hier alle Baujahre
Externer Link (&Ooml;ffnet in neuem Fenster, der Forumsbetreiber distanziert sich vom Inhalt extern verlinkter Seiten.) E31 (1991 to 1995 8 Series) Wiring Diagrams
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Alt 04.07.2015, 12:57   #17
Erich
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Registriert seit: 19.07.2002
Ort: Joso
Fahrzeug: E32 750iL 11/88
Standard Ergaenzungen

750 lock sensor 3 pins compressor vs 1 pins compressor - my research
Author: Johan750 Posted on: 2013-01-17

As the pump in my 750 seems to leak uv dye around the compressor seal I got myself a new one. Later I saw the new one has only 1 connection in the electrical plug and thus missing the speed signal. And of course no where to mount it so I can't transplant is. So I did some schematics checking and came up with the following:

There are two types of lock sensors. The first one was used with the R12 upto 09/91. The second after that with R134a. As these have different plugs they don't "officially" interchange.

The part numbers of the old/R12 one in order they apeared:
61 35 1 382 833
61 35 1 388 718
61 35 1 390 899
The part numbers of the new/R134a one in order they apeared:
61 35 1 392 410
61 35 8 360 039

The pin-out of the first type (two connectors):
x80-1 -- BL - to compressor rpm sensor
x80-2 -- BL/BR - to compressor rpm sensor
x80-3 -- SW/RT/GE - 12v from compressor relay

x77-1 -- SW/GR - To compressor clutch
x77-2 -- GN/BL/GE - 12v in Run/Start Fuse 29
x77-3 -- BR/SW - ground
x77-4 -- SW - to DME, EML,..etc. engine rpm

The pin-out of the second type (one connector):
x9988-2 -- BR/SW - Ground
x9988-3 -- SW/RT/GE - 12v from compressor relay
x9988-4 -- GN/BL/GE - 12v Run/Start Fuse 29
x9988-5 -- SW/GR - to compressor clutch
x9988-7 -- BR/GE - tap on cluster (x16-24) engine temp sensor
x9988-9 -- BR/VI - tap on cluster (x16-26) engine temp sensor
x9988-10 - SW - DME, EML, cluster,..etc. engine rpm

According to the ETK I need a new lock sensor 61 35 8 360 039 and an adapter wiring set 64 52 8 391 881. My guess is that the adapter wiring set goes between the car and the new lock sensor.
But as the compressor cost enought and I recently had the chance to pick some parts off a 93 750i I am now the proud owner of a 61 35 1 392 410 lock sensor with loose some wires.

So my plan is to splice the new plug into the wiring of the car, leave the temperature wires alone thus enabling me to use the newer lock sensor which doesnt need the compressor speed signal. If this doesn't work I'll tap into the cluster temp sensor and then it's 100% identical to the 92 upwards model years ans must work.

It seems to me in theory there are two other ways to bypass the old lock sensor:
1) Wire the input 12v from the compressor relay to the output to the compressor clutch thus bypassing the sensor
2) Also cut the x77-4 black wire so the lock sensor reads the compressor speed as 0 (as there is no speed sensor) and the rpm as zero (engine not running). This could fool the unit as it matches to two signals and disengages when the speed difference is 30% or more.
-->Both methods disable functioning of the sensor completely so use at own risk!

I found some postings on the net from Shogun and Hitmax which pointed me in the right direction. But as I collected all the part numbers and pinouts I though I'd share it just the same. -Johan-
--------------------
E32Fan:

Details are on pg 6450-22 & 23 at Externer Link (&Ooml;ffnet in neuem Fenster, der Forumsbetreiber distanziert sich vom Inhalt extern verlinkter Seiten.) http://www.e38.org/e32/e32_88_etm.pdf

I would open the A26 Lock Sensor Control Unit and solder a jumper wire across the Normally Open relay contacts. This will short X80 pin 3 to X77 pin 1 (shorting SW/RT/GE to SW/GR).

If there are no pulses from the reed relay in the compressor (because the new compressor has no reed relay) then A26 will de-energize its relay, but we won't care because the contacts are now shorted.

This will allow the compressor to run whenever K19 is energized and the pressure switches B7 and B8 are closed (just as in 735iL)

In later years, A26 was modified. The connector became X9968 which is not documented in the connector Views 8500. See 6450-22 at Externer Link (&Ooml;ffnet in neuem Fenster, der Forumsbetreiber distanziert sich vom Inhalt extern verlinkter Seiten.) http://www.e38.org/e32/e32_92_etm.pdf

I do not see any outputs from A26 that will bother EML, so I would not expect any problems from shorting the A26 relay. The SW/GR wire to EML is just the compressor run signal to inform EML that there is a compressor load.

Last edited by E32FAN; 04-07-2011
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Alt 23.09.2016, 14:59   #18
Erich
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Registriert seit: 19.07.2002
Ort: Joso
Fahrzeug: E32 750iL 11/88
Standard

weitere Ergaenzung zum Thema, diverse Teilnummern Infos:

Group 64 Heating and Air Conditioning B 64 11 92 (3569)
Woodcliff Lake, NJ Product Engineering June 1992

SUBJECT: Air Conditioning Compressor Shutdown
MODEL E31, E32 75OiL

Situation:
Air conditioning shuts down during heavy rain, or when driving through deep standing water. The customer complaint is loss of cooling. The condition disappears if the vehicle is stopped and restarted.

Cause:
The air conditioning compressor clutch is disengaged by the slip monitoring function of the Air Conditioning Lock Sensor Control Module. This module continuously monitors engine speed and compares this to the air conditioning compressor speed. The magnetic clutch of the compressor is automatically disengaged by the lock sensor module if the amount of "slip" exceeds 30%. The intent of this system is to prevent broken V-belt or reduced engine cooling if the air conditioning compressor locks up.

If the vehicle is driven in heavy rain, or if standing water is splashed up into the engine compartment belt area, the V-belt and pulleys may get wet enough to cause slippage in excess of 30%. The lock sensor control module perceives this as possible air conditioning compressor lockup, and opens the clutch circuit to prevent damage. The control module will remain in this state, with the compressor clutch deactivated, until the ignition is turned off and back on, clearing the condition.

Note: In addition to slip monitoring, an engine coolant temperature check has been incorporated into the lock sensor control module on E32 vehicles produced since 9/89, and E31 vehicles since the start of production. If engine coolant temperature rises above 240 degrees F, the air conditioning compressor clutch is pulsed off at regular intervals to reduce engine load. If the coolant temperature rises above 250 degrees F, the clutch is switched off completely.

As of 9/92 production, the slip monitoring function of the Air Conditioning Lock Sensor Control Module will be dropped on both E31 and E32 models.

Solution:
If a customer complaint of A/C cooling loss is received, the following items should be checked before proceeding with this repair:

A/C compressor belt tension adjusted to specifications

No oil leaks have contaminated the A/C compressor belt, causing slip

A/C system pressure is within specification, not overloading compressor and belt.

If the above checks do not isolate the source of the slippage, proceed with the following repair. The remedy for this situation varies with the model and production date of the vehicle. Refer to the appropriate ETM for diagrams showing connector, pin, and control module locations.

#1 E32 75OiL vehicles from start of production through 8/89:

Remove the Lock Sensor Control Module from the left hand side of the driver's footwell. The unit has two connectors (4 pin and 5 pin) and is located in the recess behind the kick panel.

Unplug the connectors X77 and X80 from the Lock Sensor Control Module body.

Remove Pin 1 of connector X77, and Pin 3 of connector X80 using a terminal removal tool.

Cut off the terminals and connect the loose wires with an insulated crimp connector. Shrink tubing may also be necessary to provide proper insulation.

Tape or tie-wrap the loose wires to the other harness wires.

Plug the connectors back into the control module, reinstall the control module, and reinstall the kick panel trim.

#2 E32 75OiL vehicles produced from 9/89 through 8/91:

Remove the Lock Sensor Control Module from the left hand side of the driver's footwell. The unit has two connectors (4 pin and 5 pin) and is located in the recess behind the kick panel.

Replace the Lock Sensor Control Module with P/N 61 35 2 233 107. This replacement module does not contain the slip monitoring function.

Reconnect the electrical connectors and install the control module. Reinstall the kick panel trim.

#3 E31 vehicles from start of production through 8/92:
E32 75OiL vehicles produced from 9/91 through 8/92:

Remove the Lock Sensor Control Module from the left hand side of the driver's footwell. The unit has one connector (10 pin) and is located in the recess behind the kick panel.

Replace the Lock Sensor Control Module with P/N 61 35 8 360 039. This replacement module does not contain the slip monitoring function.

Reconnect the electrical connector and install the control module. Reinstall the kick panel trim.

Parts Information :
Lock Sensor Module 61 35 8 360 039

(10 Pin type: E31 from start through 8/92,
E32 from 9/91 through 8/92)
Lock Sensor Module 61 35 2 233 107

(9 Pin type: E32 from 9/89 through 8/91)
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Alt 02.01.2022, 03:47   #19
Erich
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Registriert seit: 19.07.2002
Ort: Joso
Fahrzeug: E32 750iL 11/88
Standard

und noch eine Ergaenzung aus dem E31 Forum BF von cartoonz

DIY: How to modify AC Lock Sensor for single wire compressors


Seems that all replacement R134 AC compressors these days seem to only have a single wire to the plug, rather than the 3 wires on the original.
Plug is the same, but the compressor side just has the clutch activation wire.

So you bought a new AC compressor, charged up the system, and were mortified that the AC doesn't work anymore.
What to do?
Fear not, the fix is simple (but kind of a pain in the butt to get to).
This is what you have to do:
-----------------------------------
Behind the speaker in the LH (Driver's) footwell, is the compressor Lock Sensor.
Remove hood release handle
Remove left speaker kick panel / plastic cover
Remove the speaker pod
There is a plastic box on the inside lower wall of the body cavity, held on by 2(?) nuts on sheet metal. Nuts are outside, towards where your feet would be. Remove those
Now you can reach down and fish the entire thing up and out of the hole.

Great, so now you have this weird box with too many wires in your hand, what to do?

You need to jumper 2 wires.
The wires you need are these:
pin #3 - Black/Red/Yellow
pin #5 - Black/Gray (there are TWO of them that go to the same pin, use either one)

Do NOT cut them out of the original circuit, but strip a bit of insulation off and jumper them together 3-5" before the connector (X77) to the box, tape up the splice & reinstall everything.

Now you can use a new R134 Denso/whatever single wire compressor -- and it will work just dandy
----------------------------------------

"What is this voodoo?", "Why does this work?", & "What did those wires do?" are common questions.

The original design used a Hall-IC to send out a square wave pulse that the "lock sensor" in question could monitor. The reason for this was to ensure that if the AC compressor was locked up and not moving with the clutch engaged, the lock-sensor would disengage the clutch to protect the drive belt from eating itself. The lock-sensor also monitors engine coolant temp and cuts the compressor off at some high limit temp as well. There is also an engine speed comparison circuit that checks that the engine is running over a few hundred RPM's before engagement. Pretty smart & slick design really, but not very useful when all the reasonably priced replacement compressors eliminate the Hall-IC circuit.

There is nothing reasonable we can do to "fool" the lock-sensor into thinking it actually sees a pulse, so no amount of trickery on the harness by the compressor will accomplish anything. We have to bypass the lock-sensor.

These wires are NOT either of the two now "extra" wires to the compressor from the car. The wires we are connecting together basically eliminate the relay in the sensor that control the compressor clutch protection scheme.

This will not negatively affect an actual 3 wire compressor either, but it will eliminate the lock-sensor all the same.

Now, since we have now bypassed that "safety circuit", we need to understand that if the compressor does freeze up, you could eat a belt. No way to avoid that anyway with a single wire compressor.
The compressor will also be oblivious to any engine overheating situation, although if you are really dependent on an AC compressor to tell you your engine is overheating, I'm not sure what to say.
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