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Alt 17.10.2014, 20:04   #1
HatTrick
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Registriert seit: 15.10.2014
Ort: Västerås
Fahrzeug: E65-740d (03.04)
Standard FL 740d und 750d Verbrauch

Hello everyone!

My first post here. Excuse me for writing in english but my german is not quite good enough to discuss cars on a forum.

I'm currently driving an E65-740d 2004 when commuting to work which is a 200km round trip and about 50tkm/year. So far I've done about 190tkm in this car over the 4 years that I've owned it.
My average consumtion is 8.5L/100km (specified combined is 9.7) and I get about 1050km on one full tank. Speed varies between 50-130km/h with an average of around 70km/h.

I have begun doing research for my next car that will be replacing this 740d in about 3 years time. I don't really like the interior styling of MB or Audi so most likely I'll be staying with BMW.
There's three models I'm looking at since I want to spend my commute in comfort and with power but also low consumption, 640d (just love that body), 740d and 750d.

I have driven the FL F01-730d but I just find it too tired and weak compared to my E65 so that's not an option.
Last week I got the chance to spend an hour with a 750Ld, Externer Link (&Ooml;ffnet in neuem Fenster, der Forumsbetreiber distanziert sich vom Inhalt extern verlinkter Seiten.) BMW 750Ld Test drive , and pretty much fell in love with it.
The comfort seats eventhough they look the same as the E65 was a tad more comfortable. The ride on highways was quiet and very comfortable just as it should. When stepping on the gas pedal it does give off that typical 6-cyl roar quite different from the V8 diesel but not annoying and the power was really brutal. Didn't really notice much of the turbo lag.

I have not had the chance to try the 640d or FL 740d yet as the dealers around here are very stingy when it comes to testdriving these models but I'm working on it.

The one thing I could not estimate from my time with the 750Ld was what kind of average consumption I can expect on the roads that I commute.
I've read the comments here in several threads that people find the 750d thirsty for a diesel but also that the same people seems to drive quite fast 130-220km/h or a high degree of city driving which of course would lead to a higher consumption.
In my own driving I have max 5% city and the rest is mostly cruising along smaller countryside roads with very few stops.

So I'm asking if anyone here is driving a 640d, FL 740d or 750d over longer distances with modest speeds and what kind of consumption you're getting?

Another reason I would find the 750d more attractive over a 740d is when looking at cars on mobile.de there are much more 750d's with a very high number of options compared to 740d's.

After living with a very well equipped E65, Externer Link (&Ooml;ffnet in neuem Fenster, der Forumsbetreiber distanziert sich vom Inhalt extern verlinkter Seiten.) BMW vin decoder online, I don't want to step down in this regard plus now there are even more fun options to be had.
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Alt 17.10.2014, 21:56   #2
The Stig
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Registriert seit: 23.05.2002
Ort: Südhessen...
Fahrzeug: 640i Cabrio F12, Cayenne 9PA Hybrid
Standard

Do not expect being the 750d as reliable as your E65. BMW has some serious issues with this engine.
__________________
Externer Link (&Ooml;ffnet in neuem Fenster, der Forumsbetreiber distanziert sich vom Inhalt extern verlinkter Seiten.) BMW Classic Allgäu
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Alt 17.10.2014, 22:32   #3
pommy13
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Registriert seit: 05.03.2011
Ort: Salzburg
Fahrzeug: 750Li xdrive Fo2, M
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I Choosed the 750 Lix because of the big Consumption of the "new" 50dlx.....
Make no sense to say more than that ....
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Alt 17.10.2014, 22:41   #4
HatTrick
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Registriert seit: 15.10.2014
Ort: Västerås
Fahrzeug: E65-740d (03.04)
Standard

Zitat:
Zitat von pommy13 Beitrag anzeigen
I Choosed the 750 Lix because of the big Consumption of the "new" 50dlx.....
Make no sense to say more than that ....
I did read your comments about that but also that you spend a lot of time above 160km/h which is quite hazardous to my driver's license here in Sweden. Not to mention the impact on consumption...

As stated before my average speed is around 70km/h with short hops up to 130km/h. That's why I was wondering if anyone here drives these models at more "modest" speeds.
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Alt 17.10.2014, 22:47   #5
haasep
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Ort: Berlin
Fahrzeug: CLK 230 Compressor LPG powered by Erich M.
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If you drive 50K Km a year at a moderate speed the 730d is more than enough. If you are asking for fuel consumption the 730d is also the best choice.

You must decide if you want to pay around 100€ more a month driving a 740d instead a 730d.
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Es ist eagl, in wlehcer Rienhnelfoge die Bcuhtsbaen in eniem Wrot sethen, das enizg wcihitge dbaei ist, dsas der estre und lzete Bcuhtsbae am rcihgiten Paltz snid.
Der Rset knan ttolaer Bölsdinn sien, und du knasnt es torztedm onhe Porbelme lseen. Das ghet dseahlb, wiel wir nchit Bcuhtsbae für Bcuhtsbae enizlen lseen, snodren Wröetr als Gnaezs.
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Alt 18.10.2014, 01:05   #6
HatTrick
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Registriert seit: 15.10.2014
Ort: Västerås
Fahrzeug: E65-740d (03.04)
Standard

Zitat:
Zitat von haasep Beitrag anzeigen
If you drive 50K Km a year at a moderate speed the 730d is more than enough. If you are asking for fuel consumption the 730d is also the best choice.

You must decide if you want to pay around 100€ more a month driving a 740d instead a 730d.
That's the million dollar question, isn't it... Would it be that much more?
Looking at the specified combined consumption, 730d 5,6L/100km, 740d 5,7L, 740d xD 6.0L.
Now of course specified numbers has to be taken with a grain of salt but with a lot of different cars I've tried out on my commute I've been able to get within 10% with most of them. An Audi A4 Avant 3.0 TDi was the glaring exception with 19% above.
And my E65 740d that has a specified combined at 9.7L I drive at 8.5L.

But just as an example let's add 10% to the 730d and 20% to the 740d.
I drive about 4200km/month
5.6L + 10% = 6,16L/100km gives 258.72L/month
5.7L + 20% = 6.84L/100km gives 287,28L/month
Average price of diesel in Sweden is 1.5EUR/L which would give a monthly cost of:
730d: 388,08EUR/month
740d: 430,92EUR/month
That's 42.84EUR difference per month that I'm quite willing to pay for the extra power and torque.

The reason I also want power in the engine is because there are only a few places along the way where I can overtake slower cars, buses or trucks and those stretches are not that long so I'll want to get past them as quickly as possible.

But really, as long as I can get it below what my E65 drinks I'll be happy!
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Alt 18.10.2014, 08:51   #7
The Stig
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Registriert seit: 23.05.2002
Ort: Südhessen...
Fahrzeug: 640i Cabrio F12, Cayenne 9PA Hybrid
Standard

Look, all the blocks of these diesels are the same with nearly 3 litres cylinder capacity. The 750d is a tri-turbo with enourmous power volume ratio. And it is a new development. According to my information it is not very steady, nearly no offered used car around here still has the first engine.
In my opinion the risk of non calculable costs is too high.
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Alt 18.10.2014, 12:53   #8
HatTrick
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Registriert seit: 15.10.2014
Ort: Västerås
Fahrzeug: E65-740d (03.04)
Standard

Zitat:
Zitat von The Stig Beitrag anzeigen
Look, all the blocks of these diesels are the same with nearly 3 litres cylinder capacity. The 750d is a tri-turbo with enourmous power volume ratio. And it is a new development. According to my information it is not very steady, nearly no offered used car around here still has the first engine.
In my opinion the risk of non calculable costs is too high.
That's something we'll just have to see when these cars start hitting high km in greater numbers.
From the posts I've read on the subject it seems to be turbo failures but if it's because of weak design or just bad luck is too early to tell in my opinion.
I have two turbos on my current car and one of them was replaced under warranty sometime in the first 100k km. Now I'm past 290k km and not a single problem with the turbos.

Until someone can actually show some statistics with the amount of failures on the 50d engines vs how many are made and compared with failures on 30d and 40d engines I will remain a bit sceptical.
Or you start seeing that 2 in every 10 ads on mobile.de says engine replaced as is the case with Porsche 996 non-turbos. Then I'll agree there is a problem!
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Alt 18.10.2014, 17:10   #9
The Stig
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Registriert seit: 23.05.2002
Ort: Südhessen...
Fahrzeug: 640i Cabrio F12, Cayenne 9PA Hybrid
Standard

We will have to wait some more time. It's just what I have seen while looking for an F01. And what the car-dealer told me.
But for sure it mainly depends on how you treat the turbos. By mistreating them, the best motor will die soon.
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Alt 18.10.2014, 17:15   #10
KaiMüller
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Registriert seit: 13.01.2007
Ort: Daheim
Fahrzeug: F10 535d LCI, F32 428i, G31 M550d
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You are already inquiring these kinds of things although you plan to replace your E65 in three years time?
Well, thats what i call "proper prior planning"... little bit far in advance though, isn't it?


Anyway, i'll try to answer some of your questions to my best knowledge.
I have a similar vehicle history, switching over from a E38 740d (which had basically the same engine as your E65) to (in the meantime it have been several) 535d, the last one being an F10 535d, which has the same drivetrain as the 740d and 640d you are interested in, in the case of the latter it's the same technical base, constructionwise.

First of all: don't let yourself discourage by the attempts at discrediting certain Diesel engines. The same was the case, when the 535d came out ("to much power from too little displacement") and over time it has not proven to be true.
Same goes for those people whose instant reaction is: "better buy a petrol engine", who can't quite comprehend the comfort an extended range without refueling offers.

What you probably already know is that any engine of comparable class but with only 6 cylinders will almost all of the time have better mileage than the respective 8-cylinder engine.
So, you can expect any of the cars you are interested in to have less fuel comsumption than your current one. Also, of course, because the drivetrain in toal (mostly the 8-gear transmission) is better by a magnitude than your current one and much more efficient.

You said that you operate your 740d at ~8,5l, which is quite on the lower end of the scale. You seem to be driving pretty economically.
Taking that into account you can expect to get below the 8l-mark with the 750d and with the 740d you might even see a below-7 value, at least on a regular basis.
In total, all of the 3l-inline-sixes don't differ that much in mileage, some people even say, the 740d can be driven more fuel-saving that the 730d because it hardly ever needs to use it's total output potential.
The 750d pulls ahead a little in the amount of fuel it uses, because of the all-wheel-drive and it's generally more performance-oriented layout.

If you want to have an impression of the comsumption of these cars under real-life conditions in germany (which for these cars is typically characterized very much by non-speedlimit-Autobahn drives), you should have a look at:
Externer Link (&Ooml;ffnet in neuem Fenster, der Forumsbetreiber distanziert sich vom Inhalt extern verlinkter Seiten.) Spritverbrauch berechnen und Autokosten verwalten - Spritmonitor.de, that gives you a very good picture of the upper and lower ends of the scale at least.

My personal piece of advice is: take the 740d , it offers almost the power the 750d has, with less consumption. It can easily be brought to 360hp without decreasing the durability of the drivetrain and without hampering its basic frugality regarding the fuel. It then has in effect the same performance as the 750d.
It doesn't have the mandatory 4x4, which means that most of them have active steering, which gives the car a much better manoeuvrability and the BMW-typical sporty touch.

One last thing: with the ever-shrinking fuel tanks you will not neccesarily always have the 1000km of range, unfortunately. Even less so if you decide on behalf of the 640d, for which all the things i said go as well. Which one you prefer is purely a matter of personal taste. The technology is exactly the same.

PS: "Ze english" of some of our members is borderline hilarious. No offense

Geändert von KaiMüller (18.10.2014 um 20:00 Uhr).
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